cams for 103...

[brnew]

HI Mike; It maybe posted somewhere on this sight, but I was looking for some information on some Crane Cams 619's for a 103 build with stock heads worked, currently running the 255 Big Bore Screamin Eagle cams. Was told that the 619's were considerably a better high performance cam , capable of low end and high end tq & hp. An increase of about 8 to 10 ft lbs of tq and more hp added. Your expertise would be greatly appreciated.

[Mike]

We just finished extensive cam and pipe testing on a 110 with torque being emphasized. Now having done several, I believe the info can be used also for 103's when comparing to those running the 255 cams. Another thing often missed is that we must compare performance upgrades to the bike as delivered, not stock, as that is the standard (its how you've been experiancing it and upon which you wish to improve) on which those improvements will be judged good or bad. Many motor builds compare the improvements only to stock bikes and not to those who may already have improvements.

Your cam choice is really going to be a BIG function of how you ride the bike, where you want your torque and it's shape and what you're expecting the bike to do. The Crane 296's will make higher PEAK hp and tq numbers but with a significant LOSS of tq from 2-3.5k as compared to the currently installed 255's. So for a light bike along with a possible gear ratio change and a willingness to downshfit to run in the rpm range where the cams make power, you'll be happy. If it's a heavy bike with a six speed, running fully loaded and you really do not want to downshift or run at higher rpms (gear change) you will see a net loss in power with the 296 vs your current combo, all other things being equal. 2-4k is where touring models spend most of their life where Dyna's and Softails tend to be run from 2.5-5, so they can benefit with a little more cam.
Mike

[sean fxd]

<<We just finished extensive cam and pipe testing on a 110 with torque being emphasized>>

Can you share what you found?

Thanks,
Sean

[brnew]

Thanks Mike for the information & will update all after the weekend (Sat), will pick up bike. It will be measured not only on paper , but also on a exact bulid ike. I will give the particulars on how the bikes did before and after cams (296's/619's) installed on one of them. Stay tuned Again many thanks !

[Mike]

I will be sharing but it's a lot of info and I have to get it organized to make sense. Basically, from a 1700-3200 torque ONLY standpoint, the 255 cams, Baisley Prostreet ported heads, 9.6 compression, stock headers w/Y-pipe mod, 50mm t-body and VH Classic rounds gave the best improvement. Virtually everything else tried gave LESS torque from 1700-3200 even though good gains from 3500 on in both HP and TQ. IMPORTANT-WHEN COMPARED TO A STOCK CVO110 WITH SLIP-ONS AND AIR CLEANER.

We were able to get big and predictable PEAK gains above with cams and compression, but with the new 6speed trans owners are spending much more time below 3500 and are asking for INCREASED tq in this area. What has changed is the base from which our increases are being measured. The CVO 110's, with the 255 cams, have VERY good torque numbers below 3500 that are very difficult to better above adding just mufflers, air cleaner and a good tune. This will also be true of 103's with the 255 cams. There is a chance we'll be developing cams to further enhance this specific area because owners are asking more and more for tq increases vs. hp.
Mike

[brnew]

HI Mike sorry for so late with what I promised (update after cams installed). For whatever reason the upgrade with the new cams 296's Crane, was a non factor when pitted against the Bike with original 103 Big Bore upgrade (255 cams). Remember the stock heads were done on both, decked & ported & polished exact. The bike with new cams went from 93 H to 101 H and from 106.8 TQ. to 109.3 TQ., & the other bike remained as built originally with map readings of 96.5 H and 106.7 TQ. The original 103 runs extremely better from beginning to TOP end without a hitch and envariably runs by the upgraded Bike after coming from @least 3 to 4 bike lengths back and pulling hard into high numbers
(basically spotting). The guys that did the work will not accept the results as truth after more than a couple runs at it between the two bikes. The bike with the reg. 255 cams can overtake this bike @will (even while it is in the process of blowing other bikes off the map), thus the spotting comes into play. What can possibly be the problem here if any? Also the bike with 255 cams is pulling about 100lbs in weight more (body weight) than the other. Are we missing something important that is getting by us all especially with Dyno numbers bearing out the way they are? HELP ?

[Mike]

It's all about the rpms and gearing. Torque is what accelerates us and the 255 equipped bike has way more from 1500-3000 rpm. It will get the jump and it just takes too long for the others to crawl out of their tq dip and catch up even though they are making more top end or peak power. If left to run out, the 290 equipped bike will eventually catch up and then out mph the 255, but at higher rpms the tq is not building as fast and so this too takes longer. To test, start your runs when both bikes are even at 4000 rpms and see what happens. The 290 bike should slowly but steadily pull away (if you have enough road to do so). This is why hitting shift points that keep the motor powering through peak tq while going through the gears and then allowing high gear to run out with correct final ratios is so important in drag racing.
Mike

[brnew]

Mike ;thanks for your quick response to my request. The information you provided is a tremendous help to my understanding of what's going on with these two bikes & for a reference to future builds. I will as everyone that comes continue to lean on you as always. My biggest dissapointment is the distance between us that keeps me from turning my bike over to you for builds that fits my needs (East Coast).

[Mike]

Perhaps we can help with your internet purchases.
Mike

[palsers]

Mike, how many other afther market cams did you try. You are the expert but I have hardly ever seen a HD cam out perform a Wood cam. He always has more lift and with higher flowing heads a se cam in my limited knowlege will not keep up. Barry

[palsers]

Did you check the cranking pressure to Make sure they were the same. You have to have more compression for bigger cams to keep the low end

[Mike]

Go to the dyno library on this forum and look up 110 motors. The results are posted there and also some in "test and compare".